Bloodrager Bleed Damage On Spells: A Pathfinder 2e Question

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Bloodrager Bleed Damage on Spells: A Pathfinder 2e Question

Hey guys! Let's dive into a super interesting question about Bloodragers in Pathfinder 2e. Specifically, we're going to talk about whether or not the bleed damage from their Blood Rage ability should apply to physical attack spells. This is a hot topic, and understanding the mechanics is crucial for playing a Bloodrager effectively. So, let's break it down and see what's what!

Understanding the Bloodrager's Blood Rage

The core of this discussion revolves around the Bloodrager's Blood Rage ability. It's their bread and butter, the thing that makes them a powerhouse on the battlefield. To really get into the nitty-gritty, we need to look closely at what the ability actually says.

Blood Rage (Instinct Ability): When raging, your physical attacks deal extra persistent bleed damage equal to half your additional damage from Rage. When you Cast a Spell that requires a spell attack roll while raging, apply the additional damage from Rage to that spell, even on a failure.

Now, this is where things get interesting. The first part clearly states that physical attacks get extra persistent bleed damage, which is awesome for melee-focused Bloodragers. But the second part talks about spells. It says when you Cast a Spell that requires a spell attack roll while raging, you apply the additional damage from Rage to that spell, even if you miss! That's a significant boost, but the question is: Does that include the bleed damage?

Interpreting the Rules:

Based on a strict reading of the rules, it seems like the intention is to apply the flat rage damage to spells, but the bleed damage is specifically tied to physical attacks. However, many players and GMs interpret this differently, arguing that spells like Needle Darts, Slashing Gust, and Live Wire, which deal physical damage, should also benefit from the bleed effect. These spells are essentially magical physical attacks, so why shouldn't they cause bleeding?

This is where the debate really heats up! Some argue that the rules are clear, and bleed damage is only for physical attacks, meaning melee weapons and the like. Others champion the idea that if a spell deals physical damage, it should logically apply bleed. It's a classic case of RAW (Rules as Written) versus RAI (Rules as Intended).

Why This Matters:

This distinction is super important for optimizing your Bloodrager. If bleed damage applies to physical spell attacks, it opens up a whole new realm of possibilities for spellcasting Bloodragers. You can build characters that focus on these spells, dealing both initial damage and persistent bleed, making you a terrifying force to be reckoned with.

On the other hand, if bleed is restricted to melee attacks, spellcasting Bloodragers might need to focus more on other damage types or utility spells. It changes the way you build and play the character, so getting this rule right is crucial for enjoying your Bloodrager to the fullest.

The Foundry VTT Implementation

Now, let's talk about how this works in Foundry Virtual Tabletop (Foundry VTT), which is an amazing platform for playing Pathfinder 2e online. The original poster in the discussion pointed out that the extra bleed damage only seems to be applying to strikes in Foundry VTT. This means that when you use spells like Needle Darts, the bleed damage isn't automatically added, which can be a bit of a bummer.

Technical Details:

The user provided a link to the specific code in the Pathfinder 2e system for Foundry VTT: https://github.com/foundryvtt/pf2e/blob/820aba5e7db996e36a28167acef7788f3b921986/packs/classfeatures/bloodrager.json#L91

This link takes you to the JSON file that defines the Bloodrager's class features, including the Blood Rage ability. By looking at the code, you can see how the bleed damage is implemented and why it might not be applying to spells.

The Issue:

It appears that the current implementation in Foundry VTT is aligned with the strict interpretation of the rules, where bleed damage is only applied to physical attacks (i.e., strikes). This means that if you want the bleed damage to apply to your physical spell attacks, you might need to manually add it, which can be a bit tedious.

This is where the community comes in! Foundry VTT is known for its flexibility and the amazing mods that players create. There might be a module out there that addresses this issue, or you might even be able to create your own macro to automate the process. The possibilities are endless!

Possible Solutions and Workarounds

So, what can you do if you want your Bloodrager's bleed damage to apply to physical spell attacks in Foundry VTT? Here are a few ideas:

  1. Manual Application: The simplest solution is to manually add the bleed damage whenever you cast a physical spell. This might involve a bit of extra math, but it ensures that you're playing according to your interpretation of the rules.
  2. Macros: Foundry VTT has a powerful macro system that allows you to automate tasks. You could create a macro that automatically adds the bleed damage when you cast a specific spell or when you're raging. This can save you a lot of time and effort in the long run.
  3. Modules: Keep an eye out for community-created modules that might address this issue. There are tons of talented developers in the Foundry VTT community who are constantly creating new tools and features. A module that automatically applies bleed damage to physical spell attacks might already exist, or someone might be working on one.
  4. House Rules: Of course, you can always discuss this with your GM and decide on a house rule. If your group agrees that bleed damage should apply to physical spell attacks, you can simply play that way, regardless of the default Foundry VTT implementation. This is a great way to tailor the game to your group's preferences.

The Community Discussion

This whole topic highlights the importance of community discussion in Pathfinder 2e. The rules can sometimes be ambiguous, and different people will interpret them in different ways. By talking about these issues, we can gain a better understanding of the game and come up with solutions that work for everyone.

The original poster's question is a perfect example of this. By bringing up the issue and providing specific examples, they've sparked a conversation that can help other players and GMs make informed decisions about how to run their games.

Key Takeaways from the Discussion:

  • The Bloodrager's bleed damage is a powerful ability, but its interaction with physical spell attacks is open to interpretation.
  • Foundry VTT's current implementation seems to align with the strict reading of the rules, where bleed damage only applies to physical attacks.
  • There are several possible solutions and workarounds, including manual application, macros, modules, and house rules.
  • Community discussion is crucial for understanding the rules and making informed decisions.

Final Thoughts

So, should Bloodrager's bleed damage apply to physical attack spells? It's a complex question with no easy answer. Ultimately, it comes down to your interpretation of the rules and what works best for your group. Whether you stick to the strict RAW or embrace a more lenient RAI approach, the most important thing is to have fun and enjoy the game!

I hope this deep dive into the topic has been helpful, guys! Keep those discussions going, and may your Bloodragers always rage effectively! If you have any questions or insights, feel free to share them in the comments below. Let's keep the conversation rolling!